The Swarm

September 18, 2007

Flaming Lips blow smoke in fans' faces...tour on Camel's back...doin' it for the kids

TDS Editors

Update:

Wayne Coyne:

These are simply the venues Camel [the tour sponsor] chose. We have no shame playing for corporate sponsors.

People don’t realize how much productions cost these days. I’m always looking for a way to say, “Can we get to these places, do a big production and not make it $50 [for a ticket], so kids can come and see us?”

The audience doesn’t have to pay for it. The big corporations can.

More from Austinist’s The Flaming Lips Tour With Special Guest, Cancer:

Scanning the venue, I attempted to make mental notes of Camel’s full-court press on my Gen Y sensibilities: internally lit logo boxes dangling from the ceiling above the audience, free smokes flowing like black manna, a smoking lounge with comfortable couches and littered with Camel falderal beckoning to young bottoms, adjectives such as “smooth”, “flavorful”, and “Turkish” were projected to us randomly, and attractive blondes operating activity kiosks for us to while away our time at such as the Camel Sand-Art booth (I briefly pondered what birdbrained marketing associate proposed Sand-Art as an effective way to reach culturally aware 18–35 year olds.)

—

So, up next on the Camel-sponsored concert circuit: The Flaming Lips. If you’re one of the lucky folks who happens to live in San Antonio, Austin, St. Louis, Cleveland, Detroit, or Charlotte, track down your “Camel Field Agent” now… Just be prepared for some ‘next-level’ visuals at the show (and we’re not talking about confetti).

Wayne Coyne:

“At the end of the day, we get paid for a show that is sponsored or a show that has ticket sales,” says Coyne. “I wish all our shows could be free. What would you rather do? Go to a free show or have to spend a lot of money for a ticket? For those who can’t afford to buy one, I think free events are great since they make it possible to bring art and music to those who normally couldn’t experience it.”

“Not all big companies are bad,” Coyne says, “Sometimes you just have realize that money is a part of life, just as much as art is. Without one, there can’t be another—no one realizes how much it costs to put on a show like this. So I am all for it.”

So how much are the Lips getting for this go-round? According to one concert industry insider who is familiar with deals like this:

It’s hard to say for sure but I’d guess it’s in or around six figures per gig, for the six shows probably in the 500 – 750k range. It’s got to be high enough that it’s worth the booking agent and manager’s time too because obviously there is some backlash in this (e.g. your piece most likely). Whatever it is, it’s exponentially more then the guarantee they would make to play a similar venue for a promoter.

Remember tobacco companies have nothing left that they can spend their money beside print and on-premise marketing (which this is) so they have some decent dough to work with.

If artists take a premium to work with corporations, they take a super-premium to work with tobacco companies.

Oh yeah. All three of the main Flaming Lips guys struggled to quit smoking.


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29 Comments

#1 Marc says:

Wayne is right - not all big companies are bad. But big companies that target young people with a secretly addictive product that kills 450,000 Americans per year ARE!! Hope that money feels good, Wayne, while you serve as a corporate tool to lead your fans down the same path as George Harrison, Warren Zevon and Eddie Van Halen's tongue.

#2 orleans says:

Unfreaking believable. Tobacco money is dirty money. It's that simple. Taking money from cigarette companies is like taking money from the Mafia or a Street Gang; only the cigarette companies probably actually kill more people than gangs or mafia do. The Flaming Lips should be ashamed. There are plenty of other ways to get money to support themselves.

#3 JMG says:

Come on Wayne, do another song for a kids' movie. Tons of money there.

#4 Brian says:

As someone who spent several years working in the music industry with bands who were both signed and unsigned, the smoke screen of visuals (pun intended) is just a way to say it always costs a fortune to tour; but, since I watched some people tour using the wages of their own high paying Starbucks careers to pay for them, I know that not to be the case.

At least have the courage to say that you are doing it to line your own pockets or because you're strapped for cash. I'd at least respect the honesty, though not the fact that you take money from those whose number one goal is to get your fans addicted to a drug that will kill them.

I guess trading free music for an early death is a fantastic way to repay your fans for their support! Good luck with that.

#5 Ana says:

Oh come on people, if anyone one of us got a free ticket to this show we would freak the fuck out. I wanna go! I love the lips. its not selling out its business. I work in music too and the music industry is floundering right now. So if a band works with a corporate company then that pays for them to tour. why is that so bad?? free amazing gig! I'd be down where the hell do i sign up.

#6 tdk says:

Ana = Camel Field Agent

#7 Steve says:

No one is complaining about selling out Ana. Clue in. It's not bad for a corp to pay for a tour - plenty of other companies could pay for Flaming Lips to tour (cars, tech gadgets...). Tobacco companies will pay more and make the shows free b/c they need to attract college-aged kids since all stats show that almost all smokers start before age 21. Camel needs to find fresh, young suckers to fall into the addiction trap so they remain customers until their horrific deaths. Flaming Lips are helping them do that and are setting up their young fans for a rough road.

#8 BJ says:

I'm just curious of Wayne would be cool with Halliburton or KBR sponsoring his event?

#9 Ana says:

is full of shit.

#10 AM says:

is this any different then a booze sponsorship? which i think all of us would be comfortable with.

#11 Ron says:

Hell, I'M GOING! Because of Camel, I get to see a GREAT band in my hometown of Charlotte. Great bands do not come to Charlotte often, so thank you Camel! And by the way...Camel does NOT force anyone to smoke! I'm sick of living in a world where no one is responsible for their own choices anymore! Quit crying people!

#12 Seth says:

I agree. Anyone who says "I went to a Flaming Lips show sponsored by Camel and was tricked into smoking!" is an idiot. Get over it people- everyone knows that smoking is bad. I would be really surprised if Camel is successful in converting non-smokers into smokers in this day and age. I think if anything they might be trying to get people to stop smoking American Spirits for a day, just so they have easier access to Lips tickets

#13 Marc says:

Yes, everyone knows smoking is bad. They also know Doritos are bad and booze can be bad. The difference here is that cigarettes are laced with a severely addictive drug. Heroin addicts and heroin rehab counselors say that quitting smoking is harder than quitting heroin. Young people make the mistaken choice of smoking, sure...but they have no idea what addiction they're likely in for. I spent a lot of time in the music biz and the music scene is one of the most heavily marketed to group by tobacco companies...and go to music clubs around the country and you'll have to fight through the poison haze to see the band playing. These partnerships DO convert non-smokers into smokers. Remember we're talking about college aged people, not 25 year-olds.

#14 music fan says:

Cigarette companies are evil. Their number one goal is to get folks addicted so that they will smoke for decades to come. Cigarette smoke kills millions around the globe. Heart and lung disease directly results from smoking. Sure, booze can bring about alcoholism. Junk food is bad for you, etc. But cigarettes have no redeeming quality and who you choose as a sponsor reflects who you are. I mean when the Lips need money, or any band for that matter, wouldn't it make more sense to seek out $$$ from a Green business, the Toyota Prius, or something like that. The fact is that they have a choice. They don't have to go with Camel. It's a bad, bad choice. Cigarettes cause cancer, it's a nasty, smelly habit, it's expensive, it doesn't have any of the social currency that beer and mixed drinks do. It's a waste and it's severly addictive.

#15 Cameron says:

Secretively addictive? You're kidding me, right? Oh my god, cigarettes are addictive, THIS IS SOMETHING I HAVE NEVER KNOWN BEFORE. Pff. If they want to get sponsored by a big tobacco company, let them. They're probably going to get enough bad press as it is.

#16 Overman says:

I don't think anyone is going to start smoking because of these shows. Most likely anyone who smokes will continue to, and those who don't smoke won't start because Camel Sponsered Flaming Lips shows.

Nothing changes except they get to do more and more props and better cheaper shows.

It is dirty money, but all money is dirty, that is the business.

#17 ForProf says:

Really Camel is probably marketing to people who already smoke - they are by no means the market leader, so they're just trying to grab all the marlboro smoking rockers and the american spirit smoking hipsters, not spongebob squarepants fans. Then again I do have a tendency to play devil's advocate...
I trust the Lips to make their business decisions with the same kind of care as their artistic decisions - dirty money or not it's a free show for their fans and money for them to keep making music. Hard to argue with that.

#18 James says:

Hey all I know is the camel field agent gave me and my friend six fucking free tickets to see them in Charlotte.

And out of those six only three of us smoke, the other three have no intent of ever starting. I don't think after the show they are going to say "That show was so awesome I SHOULD START SMOKING!"

And we're "COLLEGE AGE" (because after all, people between the ages of 18 and 22/23 can't think for themselves!)

When did personal responsibility stop meaning anything? No, it's got to be the big bad Tobacco industry that are forcing people to smoke.

Good on The Flaming Lips for coming up with a way to allow their fans in for free.

(PS what corporation is it ACCEPTABLE to take money from? I don't think one big corporation can be found that hasn't cut corners and engaged in questionable ethics. If this had been sponsored by Walmart all the people bitching here would have bitched about that)

#19 Seth Johnson says:

Wayne said, "Not all big companies are bad." He should have followed up with, "But we were able to partner with one of the worst." He's full of shit saying the choice was made in order to bring art to people for free. They could have accomplished the same thing with a different company for what probably would have been less money in Wayne's pocket.

Camel is desperate to purchase coolness. The Flaming Lips apparently decided it was time to sell theirs.

#20 davidday says:

christ, he really said "kids?" ouch.

"the other three have no intent of ever starting."

-- check back in a few days :P

#21 JMG says:

It's really hard for me to support them in this at all. Quite frankly, being sponsored by Pepsi is more defensible. I can get on board with his whole "these shows cost money! Let's take the corporations' money" idea, but he could have chosen one that's not as fucked.

#22 Jeremy says:

I think the demographic that would go to these shows (they are going to have to be at least 18+) know enough to not be duped into smoking because of a concert. MAYBE if they are already smokers they will try some Camels, and switch to Camels, but I don't smoke, I've gone to other free shows sponsored by Camel (one with Papa Mali and Double Trouble sponsored by Camel's Snus line) and enjoyed a great free show without using any carcinogenic products. At some point, its got to come down to personal responsibility.
When I think of it like that, that I'm never going to smoke but RJ Reynolds is throwing money at something I can enjoy for free, I don't feel bad about going to the show. I wish I had known about this show, because I'd have definitely gone, and I'd still not be a smoker.

#23 Amy says:

It's cool that Camel sponsored the shows, and gave away a crapload of free tickets to people that were unable to buy them before the shows sold out. But, it sucked that they were giving away free cigarettes, as if the venue wasn't full of smoke already. When we first walked in, I remember thinking that it was extremely smoky and was wondering if the smoke machines used by Wayne had already been activated. I am a non-smoker who is currently 6 months pregnant, and found this to be somewhat annoying...so much so that I had to take a shower as soon as I got home in fear that my bedding would bear the burden of smoke for the next 2 weeks. The show in St. Louis was crowded as heck, but I guess I am a little bitter that I paid $20 in addition to wonderful TicketMaster surcharges while some got in free. But free concerts are cool...how about some more?

#24 Miranda says:

All I have to say is the show in Austin was so FUUUNNNN!
And it was free. If you are a smoker you got free smokes, and if you said you didn't smoke, those camel people just left you alone. So it comes down to this: "Do you wanna see the Flamming Lips free or not?"

If not, then I suggest you go to a show that is not camel sponsored.

#25 camels taste good says:

and they're fun to smoke once in a while. wow how evil that a company produces them so that i can enjoy them.

#26 cary jackson says:

i wish i knew whether or not the austin show "was so FUUUUNNN!" i had a pair of those free tickets...

the part no one has mentioned here is that the camel "field agents" gave away more than twice as many free tickets as the venue could hold, so those who didn't line up early didn't get in. we showed up a bit before nine, the lips didn't go on til after ten, and we were told that nobody who showed up after 7 or so got in. those free tickets didn't turn out to be such a good deal after all; i'd have rather paid for one and been guaranteed admission.

the thing that seems the most hypocritical about this situation is that 3 of the band members are ex-smokers, who reportedly had a hard time quitting. why promote something you have determined to be a bad thing, and that you were addicted to? i guess it's a bit like a recovering alcoholic musician who takes on jim beam as a tour-sponsor; why would i want to listen to anything he says? he's full of shit.

#27 CF says:

What's sad is that everyone can sit around and complain about what is going on. Think of it this way, most big artists make less money than you do, around the $15000-20000 starting range, when they are starting out. When you sign, first off, you lose all the rights to your work (sucks) and then you have to pay back all the production costs before you get to line your pockets. Also on tour you have to pay everyone that works there, and a decent amount for tour buses and hotels, food, etc.

Cigarette companies are a corporation, the more you complain the more they sell. Did you ever think about that? Because of all the bad publicity, the teenage psyche is more influenced to rebel and will pick the habit up. They make more money with those "Truth" commercials than you would think ;) Ever thought about who funds them? Also...remember who gave power to the mafia and gangs in the first place? The people. Plain and simple.

People are going to do whatever they want to anyway. Smoking is an act of free will. Let them have their money, make beautiful works of art...because in all honesty most of you would sell your "soul" for that in a second for that price. The only difference is the corporation. Wal-mart, Apple, Microsoft? They are all trying to sell you things and you will buy them willingly.

There is a difference between having a cigarette company sponsoring you, than you sponsoring them...do they even smoke Camels?

Think before you complain, because I've had people in my life that smoke, or smoked..ask them because they will tell you they made the choice willingly.

#28 chris says:

I saw a free Modest Mouse/Walkmen show in 2005 that was sponsored by Camel for their Camel Casino campaign. It was pretty gross. Modest Mouse looked pretty shame faced and uncomfortable on stage.

The Lips have been sell outs for a while. This does not surprise me. I would put money down saying more of their songs appear in TV adverts than any other single "indie" band.

Maybe they're just tired of the scene and trying to grab enough to make for a nice retirement?

#29 CF=Ass for brains says:

Plain and simple.


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